Good-morning all-I better start my first post by saying i dont at this time own a Rover,tho i gladly would do and did have for four or five years ago a BRG 2000TC with black vinyl roof and a great drive she was to! However my present project is a 69 Daimler V8250,the link between the cars is the BorgWarner 35 Auto gearbox i believe the 2000 range use aswell,iv read one of your team is very knowledgeable on these units and hoped he or any other owners may recognise the symptoms and advise me? The car has been garaged for around five years while iv been working on it and hasnt had a proper run for a good deal longer tho its been run regularly and driven in/out of the garage.Recently its started to get sluggish engaging drive/reverse but after running through drive reverse etc would seem to be ok however now it will find drive but no reverse? Iv checked and topped up the oil is it desperate for a decent run,should i drain the oil and drop the sump off or having had the radiator rebuilt may i have got some swarf or fragments from the oil cooler causing problems? Or is it a case of gearbox out! Any advice greatfully received-Kind Regards Jakson.
Borg Warner 35 problems?
- Thread starter Jakson
- Start date
The Rovering Member
Well-Known Member
Welcome.
Harvey is the very knowledgeable one. He'll be along shortly.
Harvey is the very knowledgeable one. He'll be along shortly.
Any swarf in the cooler should be pumped back into the sump, and the filter should stop the debris being sucked back into the internals, and hopefully the magnet should pick up some. As for the loss of Reverse, check the linkage, and if that's OK then you really need to do a roadtest, and if during that you find you've lost TOP gear as well as reverse, then thats a rear clutch fault which is most likely to be a box out repair. If you find that you have TOP and you've lost REVERSE only then it's a rear band fault, which if it's the adjustment or a servo fault it can be cured with the box in-situ, but if it's the band itself then it's box out to fix it.
Hi Harvey-good to meet you,(your reputation precedes you on the BW gearbox front?)and thanks for taking time to give me that helpfull diagnosis,I'm glad to read your thoughts on the oil cooler it was a concern.Regarding the linkage I moved the selector arm on the gearbox by hand and watched its movement as the selector was moved on the steering column-it all appeared to be good(is there anymore I could do to test the linkage?)Looking on the bright side-that's to say if I've still got top gear and the rear bands ok do you adjust the rear band and/or the rear servo from inside the sump area? Kind regards, Jakson.
If the selector lever moves the box into all positions that would appear to be OK. The rear band adjuster is on the OS of the casing, and the servo can be removed once the sump is removed. The servo seals fail, the servo housings crack and the servo bolts can work loose. I have secondhand parts available if required.
Ok Harvey-got that,thanks verymuch for your help,good advice and knowledge on a subject like automatic gearboxes is hard to find and usually costs you dear one way or another so I'm pleased I found you and the Rover forum-keep up the good work and could I ask what part of the UK you are in should I need any parts? I'm in the south-Hampshire way.
Essex. I'm happy to post.
ButterFingers
Active Member
Hi there Jackson, welcome to this mad house of Rovermatics...
I had a Daimler V8 , Mk 2 , jag bodied car several years ago. I fully restored it over a period of time. The same engine as yours.
Mine had the BW35 also, it was fully rebuilt but did not function well as expected.
It did not kick down smoothly, and I eventually discovered that the kick-down cable was way to long, I had always suspected that it was not quiet right, the cable traversed the complete engine bay and
looked out of place.
It was replaced with the shorter one that was correct and it transformed the car, it now driving and responding as a Daimler should.
just a thought that maybe it is worth checking yours, eliminating one more source of trouble.
Peter
I had a Daimler V8 , Mk 2 , jag bodied car several years ago. I fully restored it over a period of time. The same engine as yours.
Mine had the BW35 also, it was fully rebuilt but did not function well as expected.
It did not kick down smoothly, and I eventually discovered that the kick-down cable was way to long, I had always suspected that it was not quiet right, the cable traversed the complete engine bay and
looked out of place.
It was replaced with the shorter one that was correct and it transformed the car, it now driving and responding as a Daimler should.
just a thought that maybe it is worth checking yours, eliminating one more source of trouble.
Peter
Hi Peter and thanks verymuch for the welcome and your thoughts on my problem,having read-up on the kind of things that may be at fault as youdo in these situations the kick-down cable was one that came up more than once and the fact that it does more than just drop a gear when you want to overtake and the importance of its length? It seems its set from the factory with the crimp on tag at the carb end and that was how i found mine to be so i think its ok,i fear my problem is due to standing realy Harveys given me two things to check as you may have read,also as silly as it sounds iv never yet driven the car-we got it back to a quarter of a mile orso from my house on a trailer and limped it round to the garage and thats where its lived while iv worked on it so i have no operating experience of the gearbox other than that drive-however it did seem fine on that occasion and was sold as gearbox ok.Tell me how does your Daimler perform out on the road,isit ok in the modern busy traffic or do you tend to keep her for a Sunday drive?
The Rovering Member
Well-Known Member
I think the crimp is/can be meaningless after all these years as the cable can stretch, or shrink, or something, & the crimp can now just be in the way of proper adjustment/travel.
Or did l imagine that?
The usual confirmation/denial will be forthcoming.
Or did l imagine that?
The usual confirmation/denial will be forthcoming.
colnerov
Well-Known Member
I think the crimp is/can be meaningless after all these years as the cable can stretch, or shrink, or something, & the crimp can now just be in the way of proper adjustment/travel.
Or did l imagine that?
The usual confirmation/denial will be forthcoming.
I wonder who you could possibly mean.
ButterFingers
Active Member
hi there Jackson,
regarding the Daimler, I had it on full rego because it was so nice to drive, it kept up with he traffic or was it the other way around? loved twisty roads and wannabe boy racers in a Hyundai S**tbox, sold it to another enthusiast to
continue the marque and enjoyment....
Peter
Hi Rovering member,sorry for the gap-been a tad busy you know how itis,work six days a week home chors on the seventh-oh dear! Anyway I hear what you say ref the kickdown cable but the gearbox has been ok over most of the 5/6 year period that iv had the car and the carburettors and cables have not been touched apart from setting up the carbs so I don't think it's the cause of my problems,but always greatfull for helpfull suggestions-Regards Jackson.I think the crimp is/can be meaningless after all these years as the cable can stretch, or shrink, or something, & the crimp can now just be in the way of proper adjustment/travel.
Or did l imagine that?
The usual confirmation/denial will be forthcoming.
Hi Harvey-Quick update on my gearbox problem? I'm not realy in a position to road test my car(no mot,almost certainly no reverse gear)could all get a bit tricky,however I thought it maybe worth putting the rear end up on axle stands enough to give me an inch or two Clearence on the back wheels and run the car going through the gears,I know there's no loading on the rear wheels given that it's not moving the car but thought it was worth ago,as I changed selections from l to D1,d2 and so on the speedo increased with the engine revs constant so I think that's good news looked like top gear was there but the thing that seemed strange was when Reverse was selected it was almost like putting the brakes on-the wheels stopped a slight clonk (not to heavy)but almost seemed to be labouring would that fit with your previous thoughts-rear band adjustment/servo fault?
There's not enough load with the rear wheels running free to be able to tell you much. Selecting REVERSE with the wheels still turning forwards will stop them turning. I know a roadtest is difficult, and I wouldn't advise it in your situation because of the legal implications, but it's probably the only way you're going to be able to find out what's going on. Another way to prove a rear band fault is the loss of engine braking in "L" or "1".
PS The position of the crimp on the cable isn't a good guide unless you're certain about the competence of the person who crimped it on there in the first place.
PS The position of the crimp on the cable isn't a good guide unless you're certain about the competence of the person who crimped it on there in the first place.
Hi Harvey and sorry for the lack of replies since your last message,iv been out of comission with a kidney-stone and have to say i wdnt wish it on me worst enemy! Drink plenty they tell me-think im turning into a bloody fish!! Anyway since we last spoke iv drained the oil which was darkish but no burn't smell,removed both servos which seem to be fine and have now removed the valve bodies assembly,the plungers in the upper body all seem clean and free and the same in the lower body-controle,downshift,throttle,regulator&modulator valves all clean and free however in the manual it shows a diagram of the underside of the lower valve body with check valves & associated parts- front pump vlv,rear pump vlv,conv out,servo orifice control spring retainer,modulator valve retaining pin and,the converter out check valve(ball&spring) which is missing?i stripped the unit on the bench and have thrown nothing away, despite checking oil soaked rags and papers the valves not there? I dont think its the cause of my problems,but have you any idea what the effect of that valve missing would be? Regards Jakson.
Front and rear pump check valves were deleted when the rear pump was deleted, and if your car is a 1969 it should be a PRND21 selector pattern, and that shouldn't have a rear pump AFAIK, it had certainly been deleted on Rovers by that time. The rest of the parts should be there, although the converter check valve did move position. I think the servo orifice control valve spring and valve will fall out without the retainer, and the same applies to the modulator valve.
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Hi Harvey&thanks for your detailed reply,I'm surprised to read that the front and rear pump check valves were dropped? My car is a matching nos car and only done 85,000 miles,so would have expected the g-box tobe original,the selector reads PRND2D1L as you say but I do have both front&rear check valves in the valve block.I hear what u say ref the servo o,c,valve and Modulator valve as I removed both pin and retainer to remove the valves and check them over.When u say the converter check valve moved position?the only other valve I can see that isn't shown in my manual is under the Governor Line Plate-it's shown as a flat plate but mine (35-202)has a valve/plunger inside and a retainer exactly like the Servo orifice control valve spring retainer-a small rectangular block,might this be anything to do with the converter out check valve? Finally, my manual refers several times to the screws and lock washers? None of the screws in my block have lock washers and I can see no sign of thread lock or similar on any of the threads-on reassembly what should I use?-apologies for all the questions but I'm doing my best to get it right-hoping I don't have to have it apart again. Regards Jakson.