New Project begins, 1974 P6 3500 V8

Can you power the fuel pump without the engine turning over? Remove the fuel feed to the N/S carb and put it in a small Jerry can, run the pump and check it is functioning? Also, because the engine is at a slight tilt fore to aft, if a coolant hose at the front isn't sufficiently tight the coolant will puddle at the back of the valley gasket. Go round all the hose clamps and give them all one more turn? You'll get there, these niggles are all par for the course after a comprehensive rebuild.
 
Having that carb to carb fuel pipe laying on the hot intake is sure to get you vapourisation issues when it gets hot.
The black composite intake gaskets do seem to seal up better than the tin ones.
Good luck with it.
 
Hi both, yes I can run the pump just with the ignition on and will try the jerry can. One thing is though with the pump running & these cars having the fuel return pipe back to the tank then I guess the filter isn't going to fill completely as its literally running in a loop so to speak, would that be right ? Once the car is running though then the fuel demand increases and so it should work correctly.
I've checked all hose clamps, I did clean the metal inlet manifold pipe back to bare metal & paint with hammarite, possibly I've uncovered small rust holes but I would have seen them for sure, clutching at straws lol, as I said this set up is exactly the same as my last red P6 as you can see in the pic and worked 100% with no issues at all, also see my refurbed underside of my current manifold.
Defo a silly design with the carb to carb pipe but again the old red P6 ran like this with no issues, still I may change it though :)
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Hi all, so initial start up failed but when you make a embarrassing mistake like having the rotor arm pointing to number 1 piston and not number one lead when setting it up & wondering why it was puffing outta the air intakes! So once I'd sorted that it burst into life. Yeeeey..oil pressure right up there but once warmed it dropped to below 30psi ?? I l've fitted the oil pump upgrade kit from real steal, same as l did on my last P6 seversl years ago.
I know the oil gauge pressure senders are really old and probably not at there best. Anyway tried to engage 1st gear but no not having it . Grrrr #!@# grrrr. Its a LT77 SD1 5spd and worked fine before removed the engine a year ago, clutch works as forced the car into 1st gear and had total clutch control but could not then move the gear stiçk out of 1st gear, engine switch off and all gears engage with no problem, as you'll see from this thread the clutch fork is new and is the uprated version which has the strengthing tab welded to it, new release bearing, new pad slippers ect. hey ho the joys of classics cars
 
Sounds like a bit of clutch drag. Did you have any problems mating the box to the engine, anything needing any force?

Flywheel, pressure plate and friction plate meticulously clean on assembly?

Was the gearbox on that engine when you stripped it, or is it a new assemebly?
 
Hi Rich, thanks for the input, Yes TBH it was bit of pig to get back in, I converted the car to Manual 2~3 yrs go & the box went on fine, only drove it around the block a few times & all was fine, the whole clutch assembly is new.
So almost a year to next month (Feb) the new rebuilt engine went back in but was pig to get it too mate together easily, was lined up ok but just was so tight to pull it all together, case of tweaking all the bell housing bolts bit by bit, there no was obvious force & no threads stripped (thank god) but just an effort. The clutch works fine once you can get it in gear just getting it in & out of gear is the issue, something sticking in the box perhaps, it has redline oil in it & had done about 3 miles. Sooooo the bloody frustrating :mad::(:)
 
DamianZ28 said:
Hi Rich, thanks for the input, Yes TBH it was bit of pig to get back in, I converted the car to Manual 2~3 yrs go & the box went on fine, only drove it around the block a few times & all was fine, the whole clutch assembly is new.
So almost a year to next month (Feb) the new rebuilt engine went back in but was pig to get it too mate together easily, was lined up ok but just was so tight to pull it all together, case of tweaking all the bell housing bolts bit by bit, there no was obvious force & no threads stripped (thank god) but just an effort. The clutch works fine once you can get it in gear just getting it in & out of gear is the issue, something sticking in the box perhaps, it has redline oil in it & had done about 3 miles. Sooooo the bloody frustrating :mad::(:)
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Is it perhaps tight on the spigot bearing if it was difficult to get it to mate together?
 
Hi Stu, spigot bearing is new mate, could it be synchro issues? would this stop me engaging gears ? Possibly I may have damaged the spigot bearing when trying to align it all when fitting the block back in.
 
DamianZ28 said:
Hi Stu, spigot bearing is new mate, could it be synchro issues? would this stop me engaging gears ? Possibly I may have damaged the spigot bearing when trying to align it all when fitting the block back in.
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If you can easily get it into gears with the engine stopped, but not with it running, I doubt if it's an internal gearbox problem. Something seems to be turning the first motion shaft when the clutch is depressed, which is usually muck on the clutch plates, or could be the clutch isn't disengaging completely so needs adjusting (do you have the correct length clutch fork pivot pin? - P6B auto to Manual questions). Was it working before, with this clutch, pivot pin and slave cylinder?

Possibly, and the reason for my earlier question, you may have mangled the spigot bearing to such an extent, that the first motion shaft is binding in it, and turning even with the clutch disengaged.

Try getting it into gear, then start the engine with the clutch depressed on a flat surface and see if it tries to run away with you.
 
DamianZ28 said:
Hi Stu, spigot bearing is new mate, could it be synchro issues? would this stop me engaging gears ? Possibly I may have damaged the spigot bearing when trying to align it all when fitting the block back in.
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My thought with the spigot was if its going in gear ok when it's not running but difficult with it running isthat if the shaft is tight in the spigot it would have a similar effect to the clutch being stuck on.
Not sure why a synchro would suddenly go if you've drove it previously all be it a while ago.
 
I think I may have damaged the spigot bearing when refitting the engine hence why it was hard get it push fully flat against the bellhousing, it should have slipped in fairly easily and not require using the bellhousing bolts to gently ease it in. Every thing is new & correct Rich, it all came from the one complete SD1 unit. Worked fine when I first did it back in 2019, so thinking about it I have possible damaged/misaligned it on refitting the block.
the more I think about it the more it makes sense sadly :(, the engine lined up but just would not go that extra say 15~20mm flush against the bellhousing, almost the width of the spigot bearing! hence using the bolts to gently ease it all together, wonder if I have now pushed the bush right back into crack with just the tip of the input shaft in there but now is probably mangled hence having to force it into gear, as you say Stu, odd that the synchro would suddenly break.....I feel its g/box removal and take a look :rolleyes:. if so then I'll know why but gonna be a right so & so to remove the bush if I'm correct, so frustrating as it all went together & worked smoothly in 2019.
For the love of old cars.......or not :LOL:.
 
DamianZ28 said:
I think I may have damaged the spigot bearing when refitting the engine hence why it was hard get it push fully flat against the bellhousing, it should have slipped in fairly easily and not require using the bellhousing bolts to gently ease it in. Every thing is new & correct Rich, it all came from the one complete SD1 unit. Worked fine when I first did it back in 2019, so thinking about it I have possible damaged/misaligned it on refitting the block.
the more I think about it the more it makes sense sadly :(, the engine lined up but just would not go that extra say 15~20mm flush against the bellhousing, almost the width of the spigot bearing! hence using the bolts to gently ease it all together, wonder if I have now pushed the bush right back into crack with just the tip of the input shaft in there but now is probably mangled hence having to force it into gear, as you say Stu, odd that the synchro would suddenly break.....I feel its g/box removal and take a look :rolleyes:. if so then I'll know why but gonna be a right so & so to remove the bush if I'm correct, so frustrating as it all went together & worked smoothly in 2019.
For the love of old cars.......or not :LOL:.
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Unfortunately It does sound like your have to take the box out which is unfortunate, gotta love old cars.
Will definitely make me more careful when I put my one on the engine soon
 
DamianZ28 said:
I think I may have damaged the spigot bearing when refitting the engine hence why it was hard get it push fully flat against the bellhousing, it should have slipped in fairly easily and not require using the bellhousing bolts to gently ease it in. Every thing is new & correct Rich, it all came from the one complete SD1 unit. Worked fine when I first did it back in 2019, so thinking about it I have possible damaged/misaligned it on refitting the block.
the more I think about it the more it makes sense sadly :(, the engine lined up but just would not go that extra say 15~20mm flush against the bellhousing, almost the width of the spigot bearing! hence using the bolts to gently ease it all together, wonder if I have now pushed the bush right back into crack with just the tip of the input shaft in there but now is probably mangled hence having to force it into gear, as you say Stu, odd that the synchro would suddenly break.....I feel its g/box removal and take a look :rolleyes:. if so then I'll know why but gonna be a right so & so to remove the bush if I'm correct, so frustrating as it all went together & worked smoothly in 2019.
For the love of old cars.......or not :LOL:.
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There is an easy, fool proof way to remove a spigot bush without damaging it. Fill the spigot bush completely with grease with no air holes, take a bolt the same dia as the input shaft of the box - that would locate in the bush. Then enter the bolt into the spigot bush and belt the bolt head with a lump hammer. This will hydraulic the bush out of the crank without damaging it in case you need to re use it after reaming etc.
 
Sorry to hear of your tribulations.
I read somewhere that you can also use sliced bread squished into the spigot bush, which doesn't then eject grease everywhere when you hit the snug fitting bolt to eject the bush. Haven't tried either trick myself. I borrowed a very nifty SnapOn tool to remove the old spigot bush when I fitted my manual box. It made very light work indeed of extracting the old auto bush.
 
Before you start ripping it to bits, I would just remove the slave cylinder and see what free play you have in the release mechanism. See how far in the push bar goes until the release bearing connects with the clutch fingers. Then match this up to the slave to check you have enough movement there.
 
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Hi all, thanks again for the input, so removed the inspection plate, no obvious signs of breakage or debris in the bottom of the bellhousing, then I managed to knock the pivot arm of its clip & then the two slipper pads obviously fell off too! so box out job...took just over two n half hours and it was out. First inspection revealed no obvious damage to either the input shaft of spigot bush, hasn't been pushed back at all so that one good thing, I have a spare LT77 input shaft to tried that in the clutch plate & I can wriggle the middle of the clutch plate centre spline, doesn't rotate at all but just the movement, is this normal ? cant see any other signs of damage or oils etc, As I said it was working 100% before I removed the engine in Feb 2021 & when I first did the conversion in 2019 it was all smooth & certainly a lot easier to fit the box to the engine with no resistance all when mating it up to the engine block, so annoying as nothing has changed in terms of parts, all the that came off & went back on, still baffled as to why it was a pig to get the engine to mate up to the bellhousing when refitting it beginning of January and to why if I force the car into say 1st gear (or any gear) then I can operate the clutch fine, car will sit their until I engage the clutch as normal & then stop when disengaging , anyway I'll stop rabbling on now, :)

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All looks ok in there.

Does that input shaft turn freely in there?

Make sure the splines, spigot and input shaft are super clean, then the smallest smear of grease to allow then to move, and you're good to go.

Doesn't answer the question of the difficulty in changing gear though?

:hmm:
 
Hi Rich, yeah the input shaft turns nice and smooth, at least nothing horrible or mangled as in the spigot bush or indeed the crankshaft end but as you say still no obvious reason why I cannot select any gears but if forced in gear then the clutch works 100% ! so possibly it is an internal issue with the actual gearbox ? hmmmm could it be the synchro's ?
 
Indeed it is Stu, even thought I had the clutch plate around the wrong way but it only fits one way so impossible to do so, it all worked fine before I removed the engine last Feb, nothing touched on the box since, clutch assembly is all new & went back as it came off.....:mad::hmm:o_O
 
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