Front too high?

martinblum007

New Member
I am hoping to gain a better understanding of why some p6s sit higher in the front than others. Mine looks to be too high. D&G had a close inspection of my front suspension and found it to be all standard. They also pointed out that it looks a little high.

image-6_zpse93dbaf1.jpg


Is there a simple way to lower the ride height without changing the springs? Can the geometry setup change the height? If anybody has ever experimented with the same issue, please let me know your findings.
Many thanks for ay input on this.
 
I have not actually measured it. It was just that several people including Nick Dunning immediately spotted the slightly high front.
 
martinblum007 said:
I have not actually measured it. It was just that several people including Nick Dunning immediately spotted the slightly high front.

Without measuring it you have no idea what you're dealing with. Perhaps what they all actually noticed was the slightly low rear......
 
Perhaps what they all actually noticed was the slightly low rear......

That was indeed pointed out, but before I changed the rear springs for new standard ones.
This is what it looked like before:


image-6_zps17280ad0.jpg


You feel that the first image still looks too low in the back? Mmmmmmh I thought that looked pretty ok now :?

Well the point is that even if the front turned out to be within the standard tolerance I would really like to have it lower so it fits the wheel arches evenly all round.
 
No I'm not saying that it's low at the back, the point I'm trying to make is that saying it's low at the back is equally as valid as saying it's high at the front if you haven't measured anything. Take some measurements and you'll know what you're dealing with, otherwise relying on what things look like has no meaning.
 
What size are your wheels and tyres?

The set up might be ok but if the wheels and tyres are not standard then they won't necessarily fill the wheel arches.

I don't think the rear looks low at all :?

Dave
 
What size are your wheels and tyres?

Wheels are 14 x 6 (not quite sure about the "6" as I am not by the car - I am trying to read the no from a photo)
And tyres are 175/80 x 14

So slightly oversized tyres.
 
martinblum007 said:
What size are your wheels and tyres?

Wheels are 14 x 6 (not quite sure about the "6" as I am not by the car - I am trying to read the no from a photo)
And tyres are 175/80 x 14

So slightly oversized tyres.

The size of the tyres doesn't affect setting the ride height. Two measurements are taken to allow for differences in tyre sizes because even if you're running the standard 165x14s the difference between a new tyre and one on the legal limit can be 8mm or so.
 
For my money, the front looks spot on for brand new condition. The rear perhaps a smidgen low - I'd be looking to see perhaps an inch and a half of tyre between the rim and the wheelarch - for brand new condition. Mind you, they didn't stay like that for long, and all soon sagged to the lower ride to which we've all become accustomed.

Chris
 
Hello Martin,

The static length and rate of the front springs will have a direct bearing on how high the front sits. As a result of the design, small changes here will see verticle changes of much greater magnitude. The rear suspension on the other hand is much more linear in that a spring of a given rate that is slightly longer or shorter than another will see corresponding ride height changes.

Ron.
 
small changes here will see verticle changes of much greater magnitude

Thanks, that probably explains why there are variants in ride height on the P6.

I really just wanted to find out if there was any means to adjust the height other than changing/shortening the springs?

Thanks
 
martinblum007 said:
I really just wanted to find out if there was any means to adjust the height other than changing/shortening the springs?

There is, there are shims between the spring and the seat, providing they are still there.
 
There is, there are shims between the spring and the seat, providing they are still there.

Ah, that is interesting. Are the shims there as standard? In which case I would want to either change them for thinner ones or possibly get rid of them to lower the front, correct?
 
martinblum007 wrote,...
I really just wanted to find out if there was any means to adjust the height other than changing/shortening the springs?

There are thin shims which are located between the spring and cup, but to remove one or more requires removal of the top link and hence the spring. Unless the lower link retention bolts have been torqued up without the mass of the car bearing down upon them, (the front will sit high if this has been the case) there isn't much else that can be done, save for spring change or major swivel pillar modifications.

Ron.
 
Unless the lower link retention bolts have been torqued up without the mass of the car bearing down upon them, (the front will sit high if this has been the case)

Does this mean it might be worthwhile loosening the lower retention bolts and re torquing them when the car is not suspended? That sounds like the kind of solution I was looking for :)
 
martinblum007 wrote,...
Does this mean it might be worthwhile loosening the lower retention bolts and re torquing them when the car is not suspended?

Yes. Just loosen them off where each attaches to the base unit, move the car gently along the drive to ensure everything has nicely settled then re torque them to 55lbs/ft. If you run into trouble in terms of insufficient space underneath you can always drive the front up onto blocks, the mass will still be bearing down upon the wheels and that will provide some more room to play with.

Ron.
 
Martin, I really see no reason to lower the front of your car. It will very gradually sag a little with time anyway, but as is, that is how it's meant to look!

The true wonder of the P6 suspension is the long travel, which is what gives it its outstanding ride. Lowering the car spoils this. If you want to make it handle better, there are a selection of straightforward mods that don't include lowering. If you want to stop it rolling so much, ditto. The only reason to lower a road car is visual and fashion - not engineering. Engineering says raise it!

Race cars are lowered to achieve better aerodynamics and hence (marginally) better speed on the straights. They can get away with this due to rock solid springing and the billiard smooth surface of race tracks. In the real world none of these apply!

Chris
 
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