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p6 and sd1 brakes
- Thread starter garethp6
- Start date
Sounds intriguing! hmmm pumping the brakes is good in theory but in a panic situation you tend to freeze right when you needed the ABS action most. If you can dig up the article it would be great.
I found the article, it's in 'Your Classic' magazine from 1994. It's 6 pages long so I don't know about posting it here but I can E-mail it if you want to PM me your address.
Nigel Johnson
New Member
I remember reading an article in Autocar, many years ago. A roadtest of the,then, new Jenson FF. The Autocar testers reckoned they could have stopped the car faster without the Dunlop Maxsaret braking system. The other problem being the way the pedal rose and fell as the system actuated.
One difference I find with p6 brakes is the lack of feel compared to modern cars. Probably due to the servo. A bit similar to the vacuum brakes of a steam locomotive. You press, wait a bit then, whoa. Still, a very good system, and with the front suspension geometry, not to much to trouble a decent driver. Regards, Nigel.
One difference I find with p6 brakes is the lack of feel compared to modern cars. Probably due to the servo. A bit similar to the vacuum brakes of a steam locomotive. You press, wait a bit then, whoa. Still, a very good system, and with the front suspension geometry, not to much to trouble a decent driver. Regards, Nigel.
There's a thread running on the SD1 forum (I've got one of those too) re brakes, and in every one elses experience the SD1 brakes are awful, however mine seem excellent but I put that down to a fastidious previous owner rather than the inherent abilities of the system on the SD1 EFi.
I've found the brakes on my 2000 to be more than adequate and definitely haul you up nice and quick, that said they could be improved, it's a matter of personal taste where you go with any mods but I would maybe go for some braided lines all round, decent pads, and if they were available some uprated discs made from good material (slotted would be nice but not necessary) and not forgetting some good quality fluid, none of that new synthetic type rubbish "that doesn't take on moisture", believe me it is crap, fair enough it doesn't take on moisture........it boils away under braking long before that could even attempt to happen.
But remember, there are reasons the car was designed with what it already has on it. Proceed with care and common sense, you generally only get brakes wrong once. Sorry for the downer there.
I wish you luck getting to the bottom of your problem.
I've found the brakes on my 2000 to be more than adequate and definitely haul you up nice and quick, that said they could be improved, it's a matter of personal taste where you go with any mods but I would maybe go for some braided lines all round, decent pads, and if they were available some uprated discs made from good material (slotted would be nice but not necessary) and not forgetting some good quality fluid, none of that new synthetic type rubbish "that doesn't take on moisture", believe me it is crap, fair enough it doesn't take on moisture........it boils away under braking long before that could even attempt to happen.
But remember, there are reasons the car was designed with what it already has on it. Proceed with care and common sense, you generally only get brakes wrong once. Sorry for the downer there.
I wish you luck getting to the bottom of your problem.
I'm not a huge fan of ABS either. I was taught to cadence brake when young and I'm convinced you can do much better that way. Most ABS systems work by taking the brakes off completely momentarily when they detect a wheel lock. This is fine in normal conditions but when the surface is extremely slippery the net effect is NO BRAKES! There are beginning to be a very few very upmarket systems about which actually regulate the brake pressure to the maximum the surface will stand. Much better but very expensive.
Brake pedal feel is a very personal thing. If your car is a daily driver you will, in any case, become accustomed to its feel. The real problem arises when you regularely jump from one car to another. I have braided hoses on mine and they make the brake feel much harder than it might otherwise be. Really good and thorough bleeding also makes a very noticeable difference over just getting the obvious air out.
Alan Ramsbottom has devised the only brake mod to the P6 I'd countenance (and have - I've got it on Lucky). He uses the existing V8 calipers (incidentally, devised by Girling for the Jag E Type and "borrowed" by Rovers) and splits and widens them in order to go around a vented disc. He borrows these from a modern production vehicle and machines the hub face to suit the P6. This mod has the advantage that the braking action is still very close to the intended plane of application to the strut, whereas some other mods, such as the SD1 four piston caliper mod move the plane rather more outboard. I've actually gone one further than Alan and micro-grooved the disc and fitted Greenstuff pads. The result is as much a reveltion compared to a normal P6B as P6 brakes are to most normal mortals. I'd rate them as the most outstanding brakes I've ever driven bar none.
I am a great fan of microgroove discs and Greenstuff pads. I've modified every car I've owned since 1990 to accept them. The grooves are necessary because Kevlar based pads gass under load, so unless you provide an avenue for the gasses to escape, they tend to "float" on the surface of the disc. I don't approve of drilling as giving too much encouragement to cracking and the more normal, today, four groove discs don't give sufficient escape path for the pad gasses. The downside is that you get a bit of a "hum" when the brakes are working hard, but I've got used to that and quite like it now.
Chris
Brake pedal feel is a very personal thing. If your car is a daily driver you will, in any case, become accustomed to its feel. The real problem arises when you regularely jump from one car to another. I have braided hoses on mine and they make the brake feel much harder than it might otherwise be. Really good and thorough bleeding also makes a very noticeable difference over just getting the obvious air out.
Alan Ramsbottom has devised the only brake mod to the P6 I'd countenance (and have - I've got it on Lucky). He uses the existing V8 calipers (incidentally, devised by Girling for the Jag E Type and "borrowed" by Rovers) and splits and widens them in order to go around a vented disc. He borrows these from a modern production vehicle and machines the hub face to suit the P6. This mod has the advantage that the braking action is still very close to the intended plane of application to the strut, whereas some other mods, such as the SD1 four piston caliper mod move the plane rather more outboard. I've actually gone one further than Alan and micro-grooved the disc and fitted Greenstuff pads. The result is as much a reveltion compared to a normal P6B as P6 brakes are to most normal mortals. I'd rate them as the most outstanding brakes I've ever driven bar none.
I am a great fan of microgroove discs and Greenstuff pads. I've modified every car I've owned since 1990 to accept them. The grooves are necessary because Kevlar based pads gass under load, so unless you provide an avenue for the gasses to escape, they tend to "float" on the surface of the disc. I don't approve of drilling as giving too much encouragement to cracking and the more normal, today, four groove discs don't give sufficient escape path for the pad gasses. The downside is that you get a bit of a "hum" when the brakes are working hard, but I've got used to that and quite like it now.
Chris