Leaky Sump Gasket V8 P6b 1968

eadmr04

eadmr04

Member
I've had a small leak coming from the gearbox sump (only very small). I had the mechanic clean it all off and check when I last had a bit of work done and he said some of the bolts were a little loose so he nipped them up a bit, but not too tight as to damage the cork gasket. I'm still getting a leak and now possibly slightly worse. If I need to replace the gasket is it as simple as removing the bolts and removing the sump carefully to keep the oil in it, replace gasket and then carefully re-fit sump trying not to loose any oil, then re-tighten? If this is the case is there a recommended torque for the bolts or would I be able to tighten the bolts right up because the new gasket should take it?
 
You need to drain the sump, and if there isn't a drain plug then you need to loosen and remove the bolts in such a way that one corner drops while the opposite one has a couple of bolts slackened but still in. The fluid will then flow out over the edge. When the sump is off if you look at the bolt holes from above ( gearbox side) you will see that they are probably dished upwards, these need to be hammered down flat carefully. Then fit a new gasket without any sealant, but you can use a touch of Vaseline to hold it in place on the sump if needs be. Bolts just need to be nipped up the right amount gained through years of experience, but failing that I'll try and find a torque figure.......

Had a look for the sump bolt torque figure: 8-13 lbf ft. (But TBH I doubt that you'll have a torque wrench that is capable of going that low, so a nip up is in order, making sure that the gasket doesn't get squeezed out and broken.)
 
I think it has got a drain plug so can I just drain it, put it to one side and then carefully pour it back in the filler tube once done?
 
Why do you wish to reuse the old fluid?

Would it not be better to fill via the filler tube with an equal quantity of new fluid?

Ron.
 
SydneyRoverP6B said:
Why do you wish to reuse the old fluid?

Would it not be better to fill via the filler tube with an equal quantity of new fluid?

Ron.
Click to expand...

Basically so I know that there is approximately the same amount in the gearbox, as I always have trouble guaging it with the dipstick and the tqf oil is quite expensive. If it would be detrimental to re-use then I'd get fresh oil but if not, then I might as well try to save to original oil.

Would anyone know apprximately how much oil would be in the sump if I was to think about replacing it with fresh and also where I could get larger quantities of the castrol tqf oil?
 
eadmr04 wrote,...
apprximately how much oil would be in the sump if I was to think about replacing it with fresh and also where I could get larger quantities of the castrol tqf oil?
Click to expand...

When full the BW35 retains in the order of 8 litres. Dropping the sump will see approximately 4 litres lost, the balance remaining largely inside the torque converter.

How many miles has your transmission covered since it was last serviced,..ie when was the fluid last changed?

Ron.
 
Not too sure Ron. I bought it 3 years ago and it's got a genuine 78,000 on the clock. It may never have had new oil???? All I know is when I check it, it's always been the proper red colour and not dark or smelling burnt. So In theory, could I drain the sump and check to see how much comes out and then just replace with that amount and check the level a bit later? If I drain the sump and remove it would the oil left in the box eventually drain out if I left it for a while, meaning you need to get the sump off, replace gasket and then replace the sump quite quickly to avoid draining the rest of the gearbox or could you leave the sump of for a while without loosing too much more from the box? Is it ok to drive the car straight away after re-filling or would you need to run the car through the gears whilst stationery first? What size are the sump bolt heads and is it worth using loctite when replacing?

I can't find any castrol TQF locally but have found some Comma AQF oil which states:

"Approved for use in Borg Warner automatic transmissions and torque converters. Also suitable for Ford transmissions (including C.3. Bordeaux gear box) and certain hydraulic systems and power steering pumps requiring Ford type fluid.

Service Classification: Ford M2C 33F/G"

Would this be a suitable oil to use and would it mix with the castrol TQF I have in at the moment? It's not the dexron type.


Sorry for so many questions but don't want to muck anything up :oops:
 
That is the correct fluid.

The sump bolts are 7/16" AF. Don't bother with Loctite.

No matter how long you leave it with the sump off you will never drain all the fluid from the converter, however you will have drips for some considerable time. (Possibly weeks, but why would you have the sump off for that length of time anyway?)

Personally for the time it takes I'd always run through the level checking procedure as shown at the top of the "Gearbox" section, even if you put the same amount back as you drain out.
 
Cheers Harvey, so I'm ok to mix that with the Castrol stuff already in there and forget trying to source the Castrol in the future because it's always been a pain getting the Castrol TQF?

Not planning on having the sump off for a long period but it's just from past experiences that something is bound to go wrong and a 30min job will end up taking me all day :( . I just wanted to make sure I wouldn't have litres of oil pouring out, I can deal with a few drips so fingers crossed :)
 
eadmr04 said:
So I'm ok to mix that with the Castrol stuff already in there and forget trying to source the Castrol in the future?
Click to expand...

TBH with a car of that age you have no way of knowing exactly what fluid has been put in there over the last 40 years, but the fluid you've found is the correct type for the box so I don't foresee you having any problems with adding it to what's in there, especially as without dismantling the gearbox, and reconditioning the torque converter, it's impossible to get all the old fluid out anyway.
 
You have probably done the job now as it is December. but I was once told that you should get the auto breather tube (part 571393) blown out with compressed air when removing the sump as if this is gunged up in any way it is a common cause of a leak at the sump. I will certainly be having this done when my sump gasket is next replaced.

Cheers Tony
 
Hi all.
When I had a local specialist autobox company do an oil change on my BW65 autobox,they disconnected the pipes at the rad end,connected their oil machine to it,started the car and the old oil was then pumped out whilst new oil was sucked in!
When the flow of oil was pink in the tell tale sight glass you knew any contaminated oil "brown" was mostly gone.
It cost £125 to have this done,seeing as it can cost £60 for a couple of galls/10L of oil,and it took them ½hr ish to do it,didnt seem to bad.
But they were the ones that ripped me off re a recon box,and should of realised that the oils colour shouldnt have been like that with so little mileage,but box was out of 12 month warranty,but had only done 10k miles,and went bang at 15k miles with a destroyed rear band!!!
I am really glad to report that I recently found out that this company went seriously bust about a year after my experience!! :LOL: :D :twisted:
Just a thought ????
Wouldnt it therefore be feasable to do it yourself at home??
By connecting some clear pipe to the in/out pipes on the rads cooler,and using the gearbox,s own oil pump and running the engine, putting the output into a drain can,and the input into a new container of oil,changing then when they get full/empty?
I may attempt this when I do my next oil change,as I want to drop the sump and change the filter!
I am now running an excellent BW35 box that I replaced the 65 with!
On the subject of BW35 oil filters some say there are 2 types,whilst know specialists "classeparts for one" only list 1 type?
I cannot afford to take it apart then wait for the right one to come as its my daily driver,therfore I would need both to hand just incase,and then be able to return the one not needed!
Hope you can advise on any of this Harvey.???
As you are the autobox guru!! :wink: :D

Cheers Dave
 
pilkie said:
On the subject of BW35 oil filters some say there are 2 types,whilst know specialists "classeparts for one" only list 1 type?
I cannot afford to take it apart then wait for the right one to come as its my daily driver,therfore I would need both to hand just incase,and then be able to return the one not needed!

Cheers Dave
Click to expand...

There are two types of 35 box filter, early (flat screen) and late (what I've always referred to as the "snorkel" type) and although you can fit the early type to the later valveblock, it's not correct and will show up a low fluid level earlier, but the late type wont fit the early valveblock as it fouls the sump. Originally the way to tell what type was required was from the series number of the gearbox, but after all this time that can't be relied upon and removing the sump is the only way to be sure, and then you need to check the valveblock, not just the filter, as someone may already have fitted an early filter to a late valveblock incorrectly. If you see a late type filter then that must be the one you need.

Hope that makes things clear.
 
Late type filter.


http://www.makcotransmissionparts.com/m ... 19010A.jpg


Early type is a gauze filter which is the same shape as the gasket in the above pic.

Follow this link to some pics of the early filter, and an early pictured next to a late.(Scroll down to about half way.)



http://roverp5.proboards.com/index.cgi? ... 274&page=1





There is of course a filter for a rear pump (if fitted) but rear pumps were deleted a long time ago so for the purposes of this thread I've not included those at all.
 
pilkie said:
When I had a local specialist autobox company do an oil change on my BW65 autobox,they disconnected the pipes at the rad end,connected their oil machine to it,started the car and the old oil was then pumped out whilst new oil was sucked in!
Click to expand...

To do that on a 35 box you'll need a pump to get the new fluid back from the cooler to the gearbox, it's not sucked back, it only returns from the cooler because it gets pushed back by the fluid being pumped behind it which is on its way to the cooler.

If you're set on changing as much of the fluid as possible without using an external pump you'd need to drain the gearbox (which you'll need to do to fit the filter), see how much you get out, then refit the sump, top up with the same amount of new fluid as drained out,then run the engine with the cooler feed disconnected and running into a can (until the amount drained from the box, and the amount from the cooler add up to 8 litres) whilst simultaneously adding new fluid through the dipstick tube with a measured amount,- 8 litres minus the amount that drained from the box. And even doing it this way doesn't guarantee you get out all the old fluid due to the way the hydraulic system is plumbed after the pump.

TBH taking into account problems that can arise through changing the fluid on an old/worn gearbox, and the effort involved in actually trying to get every last drop out I'm not sure it would be worth all the effort.
 
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