Megasquirted 3.9 Estate
- Thread starter BBLongman
- Start date
I've used it in applications in contact with fuel plenty of times and found no problems with it at all. There is a link here to the data sheet that may be of interest.
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/311061.pdf
The pre-filter is a sytec filter specifically for pre-filtering. It has a 15mm inlet and outlet on it. However it is taken care of some sort of filtration is needed before the pump as I've been told the internals are very easily damaged by dirt. The bosch pump came from a sierra and is listed as being good for up to 200bhp. It came free so I'm not to concerned if there are problems as there are plenty of other bosch units that will fit as a direct replacement but with increased capacity.
What pre-filter were you using Twinplenum?
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/311061.pdf
The pre-filter is a sytec filter specifically for pre-filtering. It has a 15mm inlet and outlet on it. However it is taken care of some sort of filtration is needed before the pump as I've been told the internals are very easily damaged by dirt. The bosch pump came from a sierra and is listed as being good for up to 200bhp. It came free so I'm not to concerned if there are problems as there are plenty of other bosch units that will fit as a direct replacement but with increased capacity.
What pre-filter were you using Twinplenum?
TwinPlenum3500S
New Member
I used a reusable glass one used on yank V8s (I use an American tuning shop as it is local). It was said that it was suitable for injection, but I felt it was restrictive.
I would be interested to know the part number of your pre filter .... purely for information, the fuel pump I use is a syntec (direct replacement for SD1 Bosch) and it is poor. I am swapping it for a high pressure one out of a Volvo (unsure of model) and mating it up with an external swirl pot. Still want a filter though, as even though my tank is brand new old stock, I am sure it will have some crap in it and dont want it in fuel filter and injectors.
Id appreciate if you let me know the model and where it was bought.
CHeers Jim
Is this it? http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SYTEC-BULLET-FUEL ... 7C294%3A50
I would be interested to know the part number of your pre filter .... purely for information, the fuel pump I use is a syntec (direct replacement for SD1 Bosch) and it is poor. I am swapping it for a high pressure one out of a Volvo (unsure of model) and mating it up with an external swirl pot. Still want a filter though, as even though my tank is brand new old stock, I am sure it will have some crap in it and dont want it in fuel filter and injectors.
Id appreciate if you let me know the model and where it was bought.
CHeers Jim
Is this it? http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SYTEC-BULLET-FUEL ... 7C294%3A50
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/-BULLET-FUEL-...INJECTION_W0QQitemZ200317844837QQcmdZViewItem
This is the item, I bought it on ebay but not from this seller. You can get a variety of ends for it and a re-usable metal gauze. I've got the washable gauze as I know that there is some crap in the tank and it will probably need cleaning from time to time.
Having said that in Dave Walkers book he suggests that a standard bosch type filter will flow just as well if used as a pre-filter and can be easily replaced if they block as quite cheap. A variety of ends can be put onto them too, the only downside it they are bit on the bulky side whereas the sytec unit is quite small and compact.
Ben
EDIT: Sorry Jim just saw your link to exactly the same item!
This is the item, I bought it on ebay but not from this seller. You can get a variety of ends for it and a re-usable metal gauze. I've got the washable gauze as I know that there is some crap in the tank and it will probably need cleaning from time to time.
Having said that in Dave Walkers book he suggests that a standard bosch type filter will flow just as well if used as a pre-filter and can be easily replaced if they block as quite cheap. A variety of ends can be put onto them too, the only downside it they are bit on the bulky side whereas the sytec unit is quite small and compact.
Ben
EDIT: Sorry Jim just saw your link to exactly the same item!
mrtask
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the photos and the discussion regarding which inline filters etc. All valuable info for me when I get as far as trying to Megasquirt my Callaway EFi. Don't suppose that trigger wheel is going to let go and fly off as it is sandwiched between two parts of the pulley assemblw and bolted back together with six bolts. I reckon that Discovery-sourced in-tank unit is a really good idea, do you suppose it would work grafted into a non-estate ''vertical' 3500 petrol tank, fitted from the underside, thus without the device pressing it against the bottom of the tank?
Oh and Quattro, nice one for collating all that info regarding RPi and their approach to the Edelbrock carb and jetting. I've got your RPi exhaust headers high on my shopping list, but still can't quite see where/what you removed from the engine mounts to make them fit... Hope to get back into painting my engine bay next week and would like to remove all relevant bits of metal before I paint... any chance of a few higher-res or more useful snapshots? Sorry to hijack the thread – all really interesting stuff! BB, what does the bracket for the sensor on the oil pump/front cover look like?
Oh and Quattro, nice one for collating all that info regarding RPi and their approach to the Edelbrock carb and jetting. I've got your RPi exhaust headers high on my shopping list, but still can't quite see where/what you removed from the engine mounts to make them fit... Hope to get back into painting my engine bay next week and would like to remove all relevant bits of metal before I paint... any chance of a few higher-res or more useful snapshots? Sorry to hijack the thread – all really interesting stuff! BB, what does the bracket for the sensor on the oil pump/front cover look like?
webmaster
New Member
That in-tank pump looks really good, especially as it is spring loaded.
With respect to the araldite on the fitting, I guess it's only there as a secondary sealant, I assume there's a brass nut on the inside which will be giving most of the seal. Did you consider PTFE tape ?
I like the tank extension, I guess that will act as a swirl pot, you'd need some serious g-forces to empty that !
I love it when people quote things as "good for xxxbhp" like it's some sort of technical measurement... Pumps are usually quoted in litres per hour at a given pressure. You should be able to find the flow rate of the injectors, times by 8 to find the absolute maximum flow requirement (injectors rarely run full open), see if the pump matches, pretty straight forward really.
Any pics of the megasquirt ?
With respect to the araldite on the fitting, I guess it's only there as a secondary sealant, I assume there's a brass nut on the inside which will be giving most of the seal. Did you consider PTFE tape ?
I like the tank extension, I guess that will act as a swirl pot, you'd need some serious g-forces to empty that !
I love it when people quote things as "good for xxxbhp" like it's some sort of technical measurement... Pumps are usually quoted in litres per hour at a given pressure. You should be able to find the flow rate of the injectors, times by 8 to find the absolute maximum flow requirement (injectors rarely run full open), see if the pump matches, pretty straight forward really.
Any pics of the megasquirt ?
BBLongman said:
Hello.
I use in-line pre-pump filters to one of my other cars that I've converted to Bosch pump for the fuel injection system, as the fuel tank had quite a bit of rust residue left in it from several tank cleaning sessions. It is a clear filter with nylon mesh media so as not to restrict fuel flow to the bosch fuel pump. I have had to buy a job lot of these due to the large amount of bits left in the tank, and being clear, you can see when they need changing. But with the metal type you can't see inside, so you will have to rely on the lack of power, or engine stopping etc..to realise the fuel filter needs changing. I would imagine the metal filters will be a good idea if you had a nice clean tank so as to stop normal smaller particals from going into the pump.
Here's a few pics of filters I use for rusty tank:
Here's one full of rust :shock: :
And the top one is a small Billet filter(useless), and the bottom is an extended version of the middle filter:
If your interested in using these as a short term protection, I get them from 'In-Line-Filters'. They do an great web order service (next day) and the part numbers are: FFR-G12D or, FFR-G12DL for the longer filter.
But i'm sure your fuel tank isn't as rusty as mine
TwinPlenum3500S
New Member
Thanks for the info. I will buy some. I am concerned primarily about restricting flow. I assume they are suitable for injection allied to a high pressure fuel pump?
Slow progress but little by little it's coming together.
All the brackets and pipes in the engine pay have been painted and final connections made. The looms have been laid in place, connectors and as much cable as possible was cut from the hotwire loom. The MS2 loom passes through a spare hole in the bulkhead.
A mounting bracket bolts the EDIS module to the original coil mount holes and for want of a better location the new fuse box is piggy backed onto this. A live feed from the ignition will feed this box and allow seperate fusing of the injectors, MS2, lamda controller and EDIS module. Spare capacity is there just in case.
A set of matching ignition leads was put together from sets purchased from the scrapyard. The lengths aren't too bad so if need be can be used to order a custom set. Meanwhile they should do the job.
All the brackets and pipes in the engine pay have been painted and final connections made. The looms have been laid in place, connectors and as much cable as possible was cut from the hotwire loom. The MS2 loom passes through a spare hole in the bulkhead.
A mounting bracket bolts the EDIS module to the original coil mount holes and for want of a better location the new fuse box is piggy backed onto this. A live feed from the ignition will feed this box and allow seperate fusing of the injectors, MS2, lamda controller and EDIS module. Spare capacity is there just in case.
A set of matching ignition leads was put together from sets purchased from the scrapyard. The lengths aren't too bad so if need be can be used to order a custom set. Meanwhile they should do the job.
Lamda bung welded into exhaust down stream from the Y section.
The lamda kit from innovate. This is a wideband sensor so I can use it to at least get the mapping halfway there. I've had it running and carried out the free air calibration, will try it in the tailpipe of another car before installation
The lamda kit from innovate. This is a wideband sensor so I can use it to at least get the mapping halfway there. I've had it running and carried out the free air calibration, will try it in the tailpipe of another car before installation
Rather than connect everything up in one go i've decided to connect the sensors and inputs one at a time testing as I go along. Initially i'm going to use choc bloc connectors. Once all is proved soldered joins will replace these and the loom can be wrapped.
Connected the TPS and both air and coolant sensors tonight. Communication with software on the laptop is really straightforwad. Start the software and when the ignition is turned on there is beep and gauges come to life! Spent a happy few mins watching the throttle gauge move round. The air temp sensors is from the megasquirt supplier but the calibration needs to be set for the original rover coolant temp sensor hence the different temps displayed at the moment.
Next on the list is to get the ignition set up connected and get and RPM signal. I've already run the car at idle with the coil pack set up last year as the EDIS module has a limp mode that give static 10deg advance in the absence of signal from the ECU.
Fuel pump needs wiring in through a relay and cut out inertia switch and in theory it should start!!
Connected the TPS and both air and coolant sensors tonight. Communication with software on the laptop is really straightforwad. Start the software and when the ignition is turned on there is beep and gauges come to life! Spent a happy few mins watching the throttle gauge move round. The air temp sensors is from the megasquirt supplier but the calibration needs to be set for the original rover coolant temp sensor hence the different temps displayed at the moment.
Next on the list is to get the ignition set up connected and get and RPM signal. I've already run the car at idle with the coil pack set up last year as the EDIS module has a limp mode that give static 10deg advance in the absence of signal from the ECU.
Fuel pump needs wiring in through a relay and cut out inertia switch and in theory it should start!!
TwinPlenum3500S
New Member
Engine bay looks the part What a lovely project. Original P6 Manifolds, are these not going to be restrictive on that 3.9, I know a firm who make bespoke manifolds and have the P6 V8 emplate to give far wider primaries and collectors so that you will actually get the benefit of that 3.9.
If interested, call Paul at FlowTech on 0208 586 1717. Can be made in stainless or mild steel.
What a lovely project. Original P6 Manifolds, are these not going to be restrictive on that 3.9, I know a firm who make bespoke manifolds and have the P6 V8 emplate to give far wider primaries and collectors so that you will actually get the benefit of that 3.9. If interested, call Paul at FlowTech on 0208 586 1717. Can be made in stainless or mild steel.
BBLongman said:
Isn't that going to take a while to warm up all down there? I was told to fit it as close to the head as possible.
I know that fitting it to the collector on my manifold will only give readings from one side of the engine, but apparently that is preferable to having it a long way from the head.
This is only what I have been told recently from a few companies and forums I have asked, and not from experience. 8)
Finally got it running! It started fairly easily but only ran on four cylinders at first as I had a couple of the coil packs connected the wrong way round.
Since then i've got it running on all eight and starting nicely however it's misfiring a little so a new set of custom made leads have been ordered based on the set made up from the scrapyard.
The idle air control solenoid has also been sorted so that I can control the ilde speed properly. On the hotwire manifold the throttle flap is closed completely and the idle air is controlled by a solenoid operated pintle valve on the rear of the plenum. Megasquirt allows you to set the valve position for starting and then gradually close it as the engine warms up. The starting position is also temp controlled so whatever the temp of the engine your turn the key without touching the throttle and it automatically holds a fast idle for a couple of seconds before tapering off to about 750 rpm.
Not all good news though as I've got a leaking injector o-ring on no4 cylinder. The leak is a vacuum leak rather than fuel but still a bit of a pig to sort as it means removing the plenum top and base plus fuel rail. Suspect I must have damaged the o-ring when I installed it. Hopefully fixing that and the new leads will give the steady thrumming idle I've been hoping for. I've carried out a compression check and confirmed the fuel regulator is giving the correct pressure so there is no reason for it not work perfectly (planning to check the cam timing while I can get a rocker box off as I didn't build the engine and you never know!)
Once i've actually got it to idle steadily with no misses I'll set up the lambda reader and once that is working finalise the loom, get it MOT'd and start mapping!
I have to say that although megasquirt seems to work well it's not for the faint hearted! There don't seem to be definitive answers for some questions and tracking down information involves a lot of mouse work. If I was going to do it again I might be tempted to go for emerald or something else like that which is a little more commercial. (Saying that I bet they probably have there own frustrations)
Running on four:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO4Oc2loZNI
Idle air control valve:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBY1Ti6KZtc
Since then i've got it running on all eight and starting nicely however it's misfiring a little so a new set of custom made leads have been ordered based on the set made up from the scrapyard.
The idle air control solenoid has also been sorted so that I can control the ilde speed properly. On the hotwire manifold the throttle flap is closed completely and the idle air is controlled by a solenoid operated pintle valve on the rear of the plenum. Megasquirt allows you to set the valve position for starting and then gradually close it as the engine warms up. The starting position is also temp controlled so whatever the temp of the engine your turn the key without touching the throttle and it automatically holds a fast idle for a couple of seconds before tapering off to about 750 rpm.
Not all good news though as I've got a leaking injector o-ring on no4 cylinder. The leak is a vacuum leak rather than fuel but still a bit of a pig to sort as it means removing the plenum top and base plus fuel rail. Suspect I must have damaged the o-ring when I installed it. Hopefully fixing that and the new leads will give the steady thrumming idle I've been hoping for. I've carried out a compression check and confirmed the fuel regulator is giving the correct pressure so there is no reason for it not work perfectly (planning to check the cam timing while I can get a rocker box off as I didn't build the engine and you never know!)
Once i've actually got it to idle steadily with no misses I'll set up the lambda reader and once that is working finalise the loom, get it MOT'd and start mapping!
I have to say that although megasquirt seems to work well it's not for the faint hearted! There don't seem to be definitive answers for some questions and tracking down information involves a lot of mouse work. If I was going to do it again I might be tempted to go for emerald or something else like that which is a little more commercial. (Saying that I bet they probably have there own frustrations)
Running on four:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LO4Oc2loZNI
Idle air control valve:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBY1Ti6KZtc
webmaster
New Member
Excellent ! Great to see you've got it running.
When I looked at megasquirt I got the same impression of being a bit on your own, but as usual you do tend to get what you pay for, and I guess that extends to support too.
Still you've done a great job so far and I'm sure once you get it all sorted it will run just as well as on any of the other ecu's
When I looked at megasquirt I got the same impression of being a bit on your own, but as usual you do tend to get what you pay for, and I guess that extends to support too.
Still you've done a great job so far and I'm sure once you get it all sorted it will run just as well as on any of the other ecu's