STILL OVER HEATING !!! :o(

H

heapy

Member
Hello, I have a 1974 2200 sc auto and as per title its still overheating.
I have bought a new radiator,
new 82' thermostat from halfrauds (do they have a super wide or special thermostat or something as its a morris/austin generic leyland one ,
new engine side plate replaced and obviously made sure it wasnt gunked up inside,
new temp sender unit,
75/25 collant mix, and engine although not as smooth as a nissan on tickover does not pink when driving so not sure if that cancells out timing? (and could it really affect the temp that bad with everything new?).

Any suggestions please ????
thanks, Keith.
 
Try to verify the temperature that it is running, just to be sure that it really overheats, and it is not just the wrong sender unit or a faulty voltage stabilizer.

The temperature probe of a multimeter or and infrared thermometer are good enough for this.

If it does really overheat, check that it is not running too lean, or that the ignition is not retarded as both can cause overheating.

Demetris
 
so its retarded, that can cause over heating and not advanced then, 'ill have a twiddle.
plus i have a new seperate temp unit with guage and sender. i'll temporarily plumb that in, though i dont think its the guage or sender as before i changed the rad it went up to the red after sitting in traffic and when i parked up i heard it start to just bubble.
thanks chap.
 
If it's any help, mine is senitive to bad tune, when it's out (normally when the points start to go) she starts to run hot.
 
yes thanks to both of you, i have had a play with the timing, now i know what way makes it hot . i advanced it right forward till it started pinking then just back till it stopped. the timing was very retarded (just bought the car !!) :O) checked the plugs points etc and just slightly tweaked the mixture up.

now running alot better and most importantly, lovely and cool, !!

Cheers, Keith.
 
Is your coolant 75 % water, 25% ethylene glycol? If the ratio is the other way round then the mix will be quite viscous and difficult for the water pump to circulate. The higher the concentration of glycol, the lower the specific heat capacity, the more difficult to circulate, and warmer running is the result, although the boiling temp will be higher.

Tridon make a high flow thermostat, however I do not know if Tridon is available in the UK. If it is I can find a part number for you.

James.
 
heapy said:
yes thanks to both of you, i have had a play with the timing, now i know what way makes it hot . i advanced it right forward till it started pinking then just back till it stopped. the timing was very retarded (just bought the car !!) :O) checked the plugs points etc and just slightly tweaked the mixture up.

now running alot better and most importantly, lovely and cool, !!

Cheers, Keith.
Click to expand...

It's seems these days the timing settings in the book are no use.(well a place to start) Modern fuels seem quite different now and the few other 4 pot owners I know have done the same as your self to find a sweet spot for the timing. Could be the timing was set before you got it by a garage doing a pre MOT service and so just used the book settings.
 
I have been running my 2000 automatic at 8 degrees BTDC for quite a few years now. I run about 10 percent glycol mix. The car is in Australia. I flushed out the cooling system when I was back there in March, then cut back the glycol concentration to a lower percentage. This made it run cooler in the heat. You do not need much freeze up protection in Australia. The same cannot be said for my Rover in upstate New York though.

James.
 
Antifreeze is not only about freeze up protection, but also corrosion protection. This is more important in the 4 cyl engines that they use a mix of different metals in their construction, cast iron block, aluminum alloy cylinder head.
Run them on tap water or old antifreeze mixtures, and the waterways in the cylinder head will corrode in no time, the side plates will perforate from internal corrosion, sludge will build up in the block water jackets and the radiator core will be blocked.
We have all seen the story...

Demetris
 
That is very true. Having grown up in Adelaide which is one of two places in the world where passenger ships will not take on the water, as the water is yuk, I would never use water from the mains for cooling purposes. The water is very hard, and in my opinion is not fit for human consumption, or automotive consumption.

I use glycol to sufficient concentration for freeze up protection as well as corrosion protection, mixed with de-ionoised water or good quality water from a rainwater tank, and I take the time to change it every few years whether it needs it or not. I would rather change the coolant every few years, and over do it a bit rather than have a head rust out on me. I run about 50 percent glycol in upstate NY, and about 10 percent in Adelaide. I was running a 33 percent mix in Adelaide, and the car was running hotter than with the 10 percent mix.

Adelaide is a great place to find rust free body parts, down at the wreckers, to be sent back to England. However the heads are often corroded if tap water has been run in them. The engine repair shops do a good business in welding up cylinder heads though. The radiator repair shops do a good business in the summer time when people have overheating problems also.

These just came up on ebay. Keith was asking about radiator caps a few weeks ago.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ROVER-2000-P6-63- ... 45f1287b9c

James.
 
hello well i lied, the bloody thing is still overheating. i took it out in the heat today and had to turn back after a short traffic jam. yes the mix is 25% water 75% antifreeze. i mixed it that way as i was fed up of manky aluminium engines and aluminium oxide lumps. and after doing all the side plate work thought that would be good.... i see not now.... groan... that nissan is looking good now... i want a fairly strong mix to stop the pump wairing out too quick too. i have read a 50/50 mix is correct??? i have a morris marina as well and have had that for ten years and have always run that on a very strong mix without any dramas like this rover is giving me, never even thought a strong mix would be too slippery for the water pump to move around the engine? !! what would the boiling point be of a 75 mix too??
as for the rad cap i saw those advertised but they say nothing about being reclaiming caps. though i do have one now as i found one in my garage hiding.
cheers.
 
I've run my 1974 2200 for four years - since getting it back on the road after an approx 10 year lay off, and when I got it it had done just 17000 miles.

It was a chronic over-heater and vapour lock merchant when I got it, I've done all the tricks:

1) Overflow tank on the radiator (sourced from a Maxi)
2) Wrapped the exhaust using the tape available for the job
3) Installed a Kenlowe fan
4) Re-cored the radiator and uprated it to a triple cored one

The side plates were taken off, replaced and the sand/gunk cleaned out before we even attempted to put the car on the road.

This all had very little effect in solving the problems when the car was in traffic. I'd get the scary situation where the thing would get so hot the starter wouldn't function on stalling in heavy traffic (it did this twice in central London, no fun at all)

What did finally remedy the situation in the end was replacing the carb with a good used one (the one I had on the car was one done at great expence by Burlens)

For some reason this was the solution - or the last link in the chain, the car now never goes over halfway on the temperature gauge and is good natured.

My old 2000 auto would start to overheat when in traffic for any length of time, and was always dodgy on a hot day - this was bottom end engine wear I suspect. Unfortunately a pillock in a Renault Clio totalled the car with me inside it before we ever got to the bottom of that.

Cheers
Nick
 
ok thanks, well at least its not me then! does any body know where i can get a larger thermostat? or a larger through flow capacity thermostat from??
as the 74' one thats in it is identical to the one thats supplied for my little 1.3 marina? just a guess but i would have thought that maybe its to restrictive??
thanks, Keith.
 
You could try running without the thermostat and see if it still overheats,
I had a 2000 that would boil up after a short run and that turned out to be the waterways in the head partially blocked with sediment,over the years it hardened and the only way to clear them was to remove the head and run a drill bit through the holes,..
 
I must say I'm a bit surprised by this phenomenen. I was under the impression that the 4 cylinder wasn't really a problem on this score. For once, I am with Harvey in thinking this has to be evidence of something else awry. My instant response would have been to suggest that there were blockages in the engine coolant passageways - I've seen some horrific pictures of the amount of debris revealed when sideplates are removed. But you've already done this. I presume you also flushed everything thoroughly on reassembly? I still think it sounds like something of this ilk though. Are all the hoses recent? Hoses have been known to break up internally and block flow.

There is, of course, one remaining possibility and that is the start of a head gasket failure. Could be worth doing a compression test?

Chris
 
Or maybe after the compression test, head off time! as this would be the best to check for warpage, valve seat recession and burning "hot spots" and would give you certainty as to head waterway blockages.

Graeme
 
chrisyork said:
There is, of course, one remaining possibility and that is the start of a head gasket failure. Could be worth doing a compression test?
Chris
Click to expand...

I have seen this in the past (20 years ago when I was a mechanic) where a car was running too hot but not boiling over. Changed the head gasket and was fine again. I can't recall what it was. I have also delt with a car that would appear to only over heat on the motorway but as soon as you slowed down it was ok. Turned out to be the regulator in the alternator!

One tool we did have was the presure tester for the water system. This will show up any slow leek into the water jacket and if the engine was presurising the water system. Posible that the head gaskit has been damgage from the orginal fault.
 
hello there herm'149, i came down to yours not to long ago in the smokey marina to view rufus if you remember :O)
i got a dodgy p6 in the end lol.
the bloke told me that he used to run it before without a thermostat and it never had a problem with cooling ( minus the fact he had to run it without one anyway set alarm bells ringing) but that plus the fact there was hardly any crud behind the side plates leads me to hope there not blocked....??
i dont suppose you have or anybody on here for that matter has or would know where i can buy a six bladed fan as opposed to the 4 blade one thats on it already do you??
the faster i go the cooler she is. its now just tick over i have a problem with so am hoping a six blade would help??
cheers
 
thanks for the other suggestions people, yeah the hoses are of very good condition and many being new. i was worried about head gasket failure at first but have kept my eye on that and there's absolutely no oil in the coolant, vise versa or leaks. and there's no lumpy start up or plug fouling or gas escape when taking the cap off the rad, plus now i can drive at speed !! its just sitting in traffic that's the prob now so as above, I'm hoping a better fan will help. I'm also feeding the car nothing but 99 octane now (it certainly moves better so maybe this will help lol) anyway if any body has a six blade please contact me.
Many thanks, keith.
 
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