Top end rebuild

I've got all that to look forward to as my pump upgrade kit is due to arrive in the next couple of days. I really should have ordered it all together with the cam etc but I wasn't going to bother with one until I realised how thorough the top end overhaul is and if I'd left the old pump on it would have been the only part of the oil system (with the exception of the main bearings) that wouldn't have been touched.

Are you ready to fire yours up yet? I think I'm catching you up, I've got the block prepared, new cam and followers in along with the new timing gear, sump cleaned and refitted. Just wait for my SD1 heads to turn up now so I can get them bolted on too.

Don't think I've achieved the same level of cosmetic finish as you have though. I've painted a few bits but I think I'm going to leave the manifold for another time as I just want mine back together now the good weather's here.

I've only had a couple of cock ups so far, one snapped bolt on the timing cover which came out once the cover was off and I refitted the timing cover without the oil thrower on the crankshaft - I saw it on the bench as I was tidying up at the end of the day!

What about you?
 
testrider said:
I've got all that to look forward to as my pump upgrade kit is due to arrive in the next couple of days. I really should have ordered it all together with the cam etc but I wasn't going to bother with one until I realised how thorough the top end overhaul is and if I'd left the old pump on it would have been the only part of the oil system (with the exception of the main bearings) that wouldn't have been touched.

Are you ready to fire yours up yet? I think I'm catching you up, I've got the block prepared, new cam and followers in along with the new timing gear, sump cleaned and refitted. Just wait for my SD1 heads to turn up now so I can get them bolted on too.

Don't think I've achieved the same level of cosmetic finish as you have though. I've painted a few bits but I think I'm going to leave the manifold for another time as I just want mine back together now the good weather's here.

I've only had a couple of cock ups so far, one snapped bolt on the timing cover which came out once the cover was off and I refitted the timing cover without the oil thrower on the crankshaft - I saw it on the bench as I was tidying up at the end of the day!

What about you?
Click to expand...

I'm sure you'll be firing up well before me Paul...you have been busy! :) I'm perhaps paying too much attention to the cosmetic side, but I do find it a kind of therapy after work! And I don't want to put it all back together and say to myself...hmm...wish I'd done... :)

Enough of my rambling..time for a few pics...

Oil pump gears & spacer plate after surface grinding & fettling. Paul, I found one or two slight burrs on the edge of the gears that needed stoning off.


Had a look at the distributor, and found the LT tag was hanging to the lead by one strand and also...knackered vac canister! My lungs aren't in their prime ( :) ) but sucking on the pipe just pulled air. No movement on the link rod at all. Replacement canister and NOS Lucas points from Martin at Distributor Doctor...very helpful guy!...and tag re-soldered.




=========================

Got my alternator back today. Great place in Leicester called Green's...been there for donkey's. I stripped it down and cleaned up the castings, and he fitted a recon stator & rotor, new rectifier, regulator, brushes, bearings, pulley and fan..put it all back together and tested...50 quid all in. Happy with that! :D


 
DaveHerns said:
Sorry

I thought .0002 was 2 thou
Agree .2 thou is a bit tight
Click to expand...


Hi Dave,

I think the problem was that the Haynes clearance figures are fine for an OE gasket (.012") but not for the .006" gaskets that came with the upgrade kit.
 
vaultsman said:
I think the problem was that the Haynes clearance figures are fine for an OE gasket (.012") but not for the .006" gaskets that came with the upgrade kit.
Click to expand...

But don't you use two of the 0.006" gaskets with the upgrade kit, but only one OE (0.012") gasket as standard, should be the same difference if the compressability is the same, or am I missing something here?
 
harveyp6 said:
vaultsman said:
I think the problem was that the Haynes clearance figures are fine for an OE gasket (.012") but not for the .006" gaskets that came with the upgrade kit.
Click to expand...

But don't you use two of the 0.006" gaskets with the upgrade kit, but only one OE (0.012") gasket as standard, should be the same difference if the compressability is the same, or am I missing something here?
Click to expand...

No, I don't think you're missing anything Harvey. Not much chance of that, I'd say! :) Probably I've not explained it too well.

With the first .006" gasket and the spacer plate fitted, the new gears stood proud by about 4 -5 thou. With the second .006" gasket on and the cover nipped up, the gears weren't free. With the OE gasket and a few thou licked off the plate, I reckon I've got around .003" - .005" end float. That seems about right to me, and ties in with some of the posts on the V8 forum.

I don't know whether it was the gears, the plate, or some variation/wear in my front cover? Whatever it was, I don't think you can just fit it all together and count on everything being spot-on.
 
vaultsman said:
No, I don't think you're missing anything Harvey. Not much chance of that, I'd say! :) Probably I've not explained it too well.

With the first .006" gasket and the spacer plate fitted, the new gears stood proud by about 4 -5 thou. With the second .006" gasket on and the cover nipped up, the gears weren't free. With the OE gasket and a few thou licked off the plate, I reckon I've got around .003" - .005" end float. That seems about right to me, and ties in with some of the posts on the V8 forum.

I don't know whether it was the gears, the plate, or some variation/wear in my front cover? Whatever it was, I don't think you can just fit it all together and count on everything being spot-on.
Click to expand...

I'm with you now, I can't say I particularly like the spacer plate kits, preferring the later SD1 front cover, even if it means drilling and tapping it to take a mechanical pump.

Sound advice not to take it at face value and just fit what they send you in the kit, by checking, (and proving the sellers don't really have any idea of the problems) you've saved yourself a load of aggro.
 
Not had too much time this weekend...but still getting there slowly! :)

Timing cover on..thanks for the heads-up on remembering the oil thrower Paul! I've gone for stainless steel studding in place of the long water pump bolts. I know it means the timing cover has to pull forward more if (when? :) ) it comes off again, but I figure, if its necessary, studs will come out a lot easier.



And at long last, the new water pump on. Which was the original aim! :D :D :D



Got to make up an oil pump priming tool tomorrow...and hopefully crack on!
 
Hi Stan,

I did my oil pump over the weekend using a similar kit to yours and found the same problem of the gaskets being too thin making the gears bind when the cover is torqued down. I think the gaskets supplied in the kit are too thin to do the job and luckily I read your post first and checked my box of gaskets for a thicker OE quality one.

I notice you're going to make an oil primer tool this week. I asked the chap at V8 Tuner who I've bought alot of the parts from about initial start up and he said that he finds it much easier to leave the oil pump off the timing cover to fit the distributor, then pack the oil pump full of vaseline and refit the gears and cover as he thought it was quite labour intensive trying to get the distributor lined up with the oil pump fitted. What are your thoughts on this method?

In general this thread has been a god send to me during my project as I've read about what you've done and the avoided all the pit falls which has probably saved me weeks of time figuring things out for myself. So thanks. Maybe it could be edited and made into a how to to leave in the V8 section?
 
Hi Paul,

Glad it's all coming together for you!

Regarding the oil pump prime: I think once you've done a few rebuilds and got some confidence that it will prime on start-up, your V8 tuner guy's way is probably a good one. Well, it works for him! I'm not in that position & just want to make sure I can get pressure and circulation before I even think about turning the key.

I've packed the pump with Vaseline...


..and fitted the base before the timing cover went on...


I expect it might take a few goes to get the dizzy drive dog engaged, but I reckon once the dizzy and camshaft gears are partially engaged (i.e. once the rotor arm's turning) I can jog the engine by hand to help it home without losing the basic timing.

I did manage a trawl through the scrap bin at work today ( :) ) and rigged a priming tool up. It's a bit of a lash up but it slots in OK.
(I've centre-popped the nut and screws - wouldn't want one coming adrift! :shock: )


And I might get to use it tomorrow...but this evening, I couldn't leave the grass any longer! (I mean mowing, by the way! 8) )
 
Oil pump primed up no problem with my lash-up running around 1000 rpm. Oil seeping out around all the rockers. Didn't have the battery in (and was working lone anyway) but would have been good to see the pressure coming up on the dash gauge.

testrider said:
...as he thought it was quite labour intensive trying to get the distributor lined up with the oil pump fitted.
Click to expand...

Well, maybe I was lucky. :) Or maybe he's missing something? Engine set at 4° BTDC on #1 firing stroke before the timing cover went on, and undisturbed from then. I set the oil pump shaft at about 10 to 4, the rotor arm about 30° before #1 segment on the distributor, lined up the marks I'd made on the dizzy body and timing cover, and eased it in. Not surprisingly, I was slightly out with the oil pump slot but once the gears are partially meshed, I found I could turn the crank while pressing down on the dizzy...and it slotted home! Even if you had to turn the crank almost 2 full turns, once the gears are engaged the dizzy's tied to the camshaft. Could be one, or even two teeth out, but slightly rotating the distributor body would cure that. Anyway, happy bunny! :D :D

Checking the pulleys all line up...


Then a couple of pints in order, I reckoned!
 
Well...bit of a setback yesterday. Attaching the exhaust downpipe to the manifold...and one of the new studs snapped like a carrot! With hardly any torque on it! :evil: :evil: :evil: Have to say, looking at the fracture, the stud seemed glass-hard. Far from right, I think.

So...manifold to come off. Driver's side too. And that rearmost lower bolt is a right PITA! Anyway...sorted in the end.

And today...she lives!!! :D :D :D

Everything double checked & carbs primed...fired straight off! Bit of smoke while the grease burnt off the exhaust manifolds. Running 2,000 - 2,500 revs but had to shut down when it got up to temp...leaking thermostat gasket. :oops:

Try again...and 20 mins seems like hours, while you're keeping the revs up whilst looking for any problems. Thankfully, no more appeared! I'd almost forgotten how great the V8 sounds..and seemed really smooth too.

Oil Pressure 30 - 40 hot...that's a relief...phew!



Stuck with the airbox & standard needles for the start up...K&N's and BBW needles in the wings.









 
Excellent news Stan. It's good to hear that V8 sound isn't it? You've done a first class job there.

I meant to mail you on Saturday as I'd fired mine up for the first time and wanted to let you know in advance how horrifically unatural it is sitting there with a fresh engine revving away at that speed for 20 minutes and also to say don't try it on your own as you need a spotter for leaks and noises but it sounds like you got it done ok. I had to stop mine after a minute or two aswell as it wasn't showing oil pressure but the gauge is sometimes a bit temperamental and the oil light wasn't on so I waggled a wire or two and went for it.

Have you had a drive it yet? Took mine out last night and I have to say it was nice to get it on the road and it was a bit more brisk than before so that's good. I plan to ween it off Shell V-Power over the next couple of weeks and get it tuned up to run on 95RON. I'll need to take some advice on SU needles at that point though. There's always something to do isn't there?
 
Hi Paul,

You're right...20 minutes of brown trouser moments! What's that noise.............? :)

Not had the pleasure of a drive yet. I've put a new brake master cylinder on so the system needs bleeding, after I've fitted the 2 new Girling front brake hoses I picked up for a song. Also, there's the clutch still to sort. New master and slave cylinders on, so that to bleed and set up too. Then there's the little matter of getting a fresh MOT as that expired in February. Like you say, always something isn't there!

By the way, thanks for your tip about using a syringe to prime the carbs. Worked a treat. :)

Cheers mate,
 
Hello Stan,

Excellent news on your very successful engine start and running in procedure for the camshaft... :D I bet your heart was doing a million bpm when you turned the key initially!

The engine looks fantastic Stan!

10 out of 10.... :D

Ron.
 
SydneyRoverP6B said:
Hello Stan,

Excellent news on your very successful engine start and running in procedure for the camshaft... :D I bet your heart was doing a million bpm when you turned the key initially!

The engine looks fantastic Stan!

10 out of 10.... :D

Ron.
Click to expand...

Many thanks Ron. Yes, I'm pleased with the result...and only a couple of months late on my original plan! Glad I took the time to do other bits along the way though. :)

Proof of the pudding will be when I get her on the road of course.

Cheers,
 
Well done Stan it sounds like it was worth all the extra hassle in the end. The camshaft running in thing is a bit daunting at first, I remember the first one I did when I rebuilt the engine on my mate's Mk1 Escort & I kept thinking "surely that's not right" but it is & it turned out to be a cracking engine.

Regards Colin
 
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