Demetris
Well-Known Member
Exactly. After all those years and neglected linkages, i think that very few drivers have the chance to experience how good was the gearchange when it was as Rover intended.
Getting back on the road
- Thread starter sdibbers
- Start date
Exactly. After all those years and neglected linkages, i think that very few drivers have the chance to experience how good was the gearchange when it was as Rover intended.
sdibbers
Well-Known Member
To be fair, it was criticised in contemporary road tests when new.
sdibbers
Well-Known Member
It was all going so well...
I had noticed a little popping at idle when the choke was out on cold starts. Hoping against hope that it was badly balanced cold start valves (I have twin HIF6s fitted to Beryl). But last weekend it was there when warm and I could feel a slight drop in power.
I ran a compression test on the warm engine and cyl 2 showed a slight drop since the last test a few years back (others were very close or even a little higher). I did a wet test and there was a slight improvement. Knowing that I've had rings go bad on the 2200 pistons in the past I do wonder if that's the culprit. I do have spare new rings if so. I also know that at least one valve guide was a little sloppy, but I haven't really done any top end refurb on the car. I have got 3x intake and 3x exhaust valve guides from my ebay habit.
So, next will be a leak down test.
I have a spare head that could use new seats and guides so I'll probably use that one for machining. It's not been decked and tests as being flat still otherwise.
I hope to whip off the manifolds and run a leak down before I leave for the UK on Saturday. I'll grab new valves while there and, fingers crossed I can sort the problem before the end of Sept to still use her at Lime Rock Park for the VSSCA's Fall Finale race weekend. If not, it'll just be the mini.
With the head sorted that'll be most stuff sorted on the engine, you'll have to excuse the bit meal approach to the rebuild. Its been when time and money allow.
I had noticed a little popping at idle when the choke was out on cold starts. Hoping against hope that it was badly balanced cold start valves (I have twin HIF6s fitted to Beryl). But last weekend it was there when warm and I could feel a slight drop in power.
I ran a compression test on the warm engine and cyl 2 showed a slight drop since the last test a few years back (others were very close or even a little higher). I did a wet test and there was a slight improvement. Knowing that I've had rings go bad on the 2200 pistons in the past I do wonder if that's the culprit. I do have spare new rings if so. I also know that at least one valve guide was a little sloppy, but I haven't really done any top end refurb on the car. I have got 3x intake and 3x exhaust valve guides from my ebay habit.
So, next will be a leak down test.
I have a spare head that could use new seats and guides so I'll probably use that one for machining. It's not been decked and tests as being flat still otherwise.
I hope to whip off the manifolds and run a leak down before I leave for the UK on Saturday. I'll grab new valves while there and, fingers crossed I can sort the problem before the end of Sept to still use her at Lime Rock Park for the VSSCA's Fall Finale race weekend. If not, it'll just be the mini.
With the head sorted that'll be most stuff sorted on the engine, you'll have to excuse the bit meal approach to the rebuild. Its been when time and money allow.
sdibbers
Well-Known Member
Head is now with the engine shop. I was back home last week for Goodwood Revival (I know, showing off - but seriously you have to go!). While back home I stopped by Wins and picked up new guides and valves, along with new UJs for the half shafts. Dropped the head bits off with the engine shop chap (Charles Unger in Pearl River NY if you’re looking for a reliable engine shop). On the morning after returning. Fingers crossed the head will be ready in time for Fall Finale at Lime Rock Park, I’m excited to see how the new suspension feels on the track.
sdibbers
Well-Known Member
While I’m waiting on the head coming back from the machinists I decided to attend to something I’d noticed when doing the diff output seal a while back. I could see a little movement in the right hand half shaft UJs when reassembling it.
So, off with the half shaft. It comes out pretty easily six nuts and bolts secured the hub end to the dedion elbow. Despite the nuts being inside the elbow and working by feel they were surprisingly easy to undo. Then the four securing to the output flange and brake disc. Pull the shaft out through the elbow (the plastic shield likes to catch and make things a little bit of a pain and it’s out. Blimey it’s not a light part!
Before removing the UJs I marked each end to ensure everything went back the same way. Probably unnecessary, but I felt it worth doing. Getting the old UJ’s proved easy on the hub end. But the UJ on the diff end was a different story!! Rust had worked its way between the bearing caps and the yoke. It took a good two hours to coax them out! But once out I could reassemble.
The new UJs come with grease nipples which is a nice upgrade. The old ones were bone dry after 54 years. But that makes them a little bulky, plus there’s a pronounced flash rib around the edge of the spider. This meant they can’t just be fitted, I had to selectively grind away the ribs a little of the body to get them to fit into the yokes. I kept the bearing caps in place as I did that, sealing the important bearing surfaces from grinding dust.
After a couple of false starts (needles not staying in place while driving the caps in) I was able to get the UJ back together. “Red and Sticky” grease is your friend here I’ve discovered.
Reassembly was reverse of dismantling. I found putting two elbow bolts in first with nuts on loosely followed by two bolts on the diff end held everything in place. The shaft (especially the hub) is quiet weighty, so having it supported helped a lot.
Once everything was torqued to spec (20 ftlbs for hub end bolts and 80 ftlbs for diff end) all was done. One note on the diff bolts. I switched to red Loctite thread lock a couple of years ago instead of the tab washers. In that time nothing has loosened and it makes for much easier assembly. Worth considering if you do this.
So worth the effort? Definitely. If you’d asked me before hand if I had noise or vibration in the back end I would’ve said ‘no’. But the car is certainly smoother and quieter now. Plus the rear end feels a little tighter - that could be imagined on my part, but I don’t think so.
Remember these UJs do triple duty. They transmit drive and braking forces with the onboard discs. Plus that take cornering forces and push those through to the diff and it’s mounts. Worth checking yours
So, off with the half shaft. It comes out pretty easily six nuts and bolts secured the hub end to the dedion elbow. Despite the nuts being inside the elbow and working by feel they were surprisingly easy to undo. Then the four securing to the output flange and brake disc. Pull the shaft out through the elbow (the plastic shield likes to catch and make things a little bit of a pain and it’s out. Blimey it’s not a light part!
Before removing the UJs I marked each end to ensure everything went back the same way. Probably unnecessary, but I felt it worth doing. Getting the old UJ’s proved easy on the hub end. But the UJ on the diff end was a different story!! Rust had worked its way between the bearing caps and the yoke. It took a good two hours to coax them out! But once out I could reassemble.
The new UJs come with grease nipples which is a nice upgrade. The old ones were bone dry after 54 years. But that makes them a little bulky, plus there’s a pronounced flash rib around the edge of the spider. This meant they can’t just be fitted, I had to selectively grind away the ribs a little of the body to get them to fit into the yokes. I kept the bearing caps in place as I did that, sealing the important bearing surfaces from grinding dust.
After a couple of false starts (needles not staying in place while driving the caps in) I was able to get the UJ back together. “Red and Sticky” grease is your friend here I’ve discovered.
Reassembly was reverse of dismantling. I found putting two elbow bolts in first with nuts on loosely followed by two bolts on the diff end held everything in place. The shaft (especially the hub) is quiet weighty, so having it supported helped a lot.
Once everything was torqued to spec (20 ftlbs for hub end bolts and 80 ftlbs for diff end) all was done. One note on the diff bolts. I switched to red Loctite thread lock a couple of years ago instead of the tab washers. In that time nothing has loosened and it makes for much easier assembly. Worth considering if you do this.
So worth the effort? Definitely. If you’d asked me before hand if I had noise or vibration in the back end I would’ve said ‘no’. But the car is certainly smoother and quieter now. Plus the rear end feels a little tighter - that could be imagined on my part, but I don’t think so.
Remember these UJs do triple duty. They transmit drive and braking forces with the onboard discs. Plus that take cornering forces and push those through to the diff and it’s mounts. Worth checking yours
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sdibbers
Well-Known Member
Well, I wasn’t smoking crack. My other half describes me as an automotive hypochondriac, and for once I wasn’t! The popping I’d heard from the exhaust was probably partly down to the very worn valve guides and valves. But also down to a failing head gasket. When I removed the head I found this path where gas was making it past the fire ring of no. 2 cylinder.
I’ve had the spare head worked on. It checked out for flatness so I avoided getting it skimmed knowing that that can affect chain tension. When I was home in the UK at the beginning of the month I picked up new valves, guides, stem seals etc. the machine shop also fitted new seats and we worked on getting the right contact area for the valves to the seat. I should mention the seats now have a triple angle machined into them so flow should be improved.
At the end of today I’ve fitted the valves and springs after lapping. The old head has been removed (hence finding the bad head gasket). The valve guides in the old head were badly worn, if pulled out slightly there was a good 0.030” of lateral play.
Plan for tomorrow is to set new valve clearances and refit the new cylinder head. I hope to have the car ready for racing in the preservation class at the VSCCA Fall Finale at Lime Rock Park. Time to text out those suspension modifications!
I’ve had the spare head worked on. It checked out for flatness so I avoided getting it skimmed knowing that that can affect chain tension. When I was home in the UK at the beginning of the month I picked up new valves, guides, stem seals etc. the machine shop also fitted new seats and we worked on getting the right contact area for the valves to the seat. I should mention the seats now have a triple angle machined into them so flow should be improved.
At the end of today I’ve fitted the valves and springs after lapping. The old head has been removed (hence finding the bad head gasket). The valve guides in the old head were badly worn, if pulled out slightly there was a good 0.030” of lateral play.
Plan for tomorrow is to set new valve clearances and refit the new cylinder head. I hope to have the car ready for racing in the preservation class at the VSCCA Fall Finale at Lime Rock Park. Time to text out those suspension modifications!
jp928
Well-Known Member
Making real progress there, good job!
Whats your process for doing the valve clearances? Years ago friends in the trade had a jig made - 1" steel plate, surface ground, drilled and tapped for 2000 head bolts, and then holes for the valve heads cut right through. This enabled you to bolt the head down on an old gasket, measure the clearances, dismantle, swap shims, bolt down , check etc. And all done on the bench!
Whats your process for doing the valve clearances? Years ago friends in the trade had a jig made - 1" steel plate, surface ground, drilled and tapped for 2000 head bolts, and then holes for the valve heads cut right through. This enabled you to bolt the head down on an old gasket, measure the clearances, dismantle, swap shims, bolt down , check etc. And all done on the bench!
sdibbers
Well-Known Member
I have a spare engine on a trolley. Similar setup to your fixture but I just sit on a stool and work through the valves measuring tappet clearances. Using the shims I had in there previously as a starting point I was able to use my calculator spreadsheet to generate the correct values for the shim stacks. All in place now and head is back on the engine. Should hopefully have it running today ready for the end of the week.
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sdibbers
Well-Known Member
Doing the valve clearances with the head installed can be a right royal pain in the arse. So getting them right beforehand really helps. It takes being systematic with measurements and calculations (I had 3 hours sleep the night before which doesn't help). So it took me a couple hours to measure, calculate and find suitable shims beforehand.
Head is back in place along with the carbs and everything else. I tried starting her this morning, but I reckon I had flooded the engine turning it over to get oil pressure. That and I had to clean the cylinders with some brake cleaner when apart which probably gave me ring wash - so low compression. I ran out of time before work, so I left the plugs out to dry things. I'll squirt a little oil into each bore to help the rings seal this evening followed by another attempt to start it. Stay tuned!
Head is back in place along with the carbs and everything else. I tried starting her this morning, but I reckon I had flooded the engine turning it over to get oil pressure. That and I had to clean the cylinders with some brake cleaner when apart which probably gave me ring wash - so low compression. I ran out of time before work, so I left the plugs out to dry things. I'll squirt a little oil into each bore to help the rings seal this evening followed by another attempt to start it. Stay tuned!
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sdibbers
Well-Known Member
And… we have a running car. I think a combination of flooding and ring wash stopped me from being able to start the car yesterday morning. A small squirt of oil in each cylinder after a day of the plugs out to dry them out and she started up straight away.
Interestingly, the front carb needed to be leaned off a little. Obviously I had unknowingly compensated for the diff head gasket at no 2 cylinder before.
Idle is smoother than I’ve known it ever. Power delivery is much smoother, making it feel quite different to gruffness it had before (the boy racer in me missed the gruff note a little!).
Very happy with the results of all that work. A short video of the now (almost too quiet) exhaust note.
Interestingly, the front carb needed to be leaned off a little. Obviously I had unknowingly compensated for the diff head gasket at no 2 cylinder before.
Idle is smoother than I’ve known it ever. Power delivery is much smoother, making it feel quite different to gruffness it had before (the boy racer in me missed the gruff note a little!).
Very happy with the results of all that work. A short video of the now (almost too quiet) exhaust note.
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sdibbers
Well-Known Member
Forza Ficara is roughly Italian for Force Old Iron. A group of us made them because of a friend that owns a shop in white Plains NY. Santo is a lovely person and a good friend so a few of us made the stickers as a sort of 'in joke'.
What does the script on the bottom left of the boot lid mean?
Petrolicous made a great video about Santo's family shop, and in particular, his father. Well worth your time to watch:
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sdibbers
Well-Known Member
Yes, that's a favourite line of mine too.
sdibbers
Well-Known Member
Beryl did great this race weekend! Surprising a few others in the preservation class (myself included). The suspension mods worked perfectly on the track, handling was perfectly neutral, there is enough feel a poise that you can rotate her mid corner if you screw up your line (which I may have learned the hard way!). The new head complemented the rest of the engine build and she was pulling like a train ok the main straight. Very happy with the outcome.
unfortunately she did blot her copy book at the end of the day. I think the due filter failed and a large piece of dirt from the tank got into the front float valve. Petrol was everywhere! I have HIF6’s fitted so had to pull the front carb and strip it in the paddock. Got her running, but had an occasional misfire in 4th below 2500rpm. Driving above 75mph she felt fine. To compound this I’d lost my phone (turned up under the seat of a friends car I’d taken for a spin that afternoon) so another friend rode home with me and her boyfriend so I wouldn’t be stranded if the car died.
Today I’ll go through the Ignition and fuel system and see if I can find the problem. The engine still feels great and idle is dead smooth. Fix this and she’s ready to roll again!
unfortunately she did blot her copy book at the end of the day. I think the due filter failed and a large piece of dirt from the tank got into the front float valve. Petrol was everywhere! I have HIF6’s fitted so had to pull the front carb and strip it in the paddock. Got her running, but had an occasional misfire in 4th below 2500rpm. Driving above 75mph she felt fine. To compound this I’d lost my phone (turned up under the seat of a friends car I’d taken for a spin that afternoon) so another friend rode home with me and her boyfriend so I wouldn’t be stranded if the car died.
Today I’ll go through the Ignition and fuel system and see if I can find the problem. The engine still feels great and idle is dead smooth. Fix this and she’s ready to roll again!
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sdibbers
Well-Known Member
One thing that made me chuckle. There was a real mix of cars in preservation class. Everything from an early Morgan three wheeler to an Allard. At one point I caught back up with the Morgan and a Formula Vee single seater on the straight. The Morgan gave us both a point by. So the Vee goes and I floor it too, much to my (and the Vee’s) surprise I’m out accelerating both. There’s this point where we’re three abreast and the Vee driver notices this large blue lump going past him. We both look at each other keep going. It was a hoot.
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sdibbers
Well-Known Member
I might have to Mark! The Pirelli CN36's did pretty well though. Still hunting down the miss on the engine. Carbs are sparkling clean. Had to replace the coil as that had decided to die too (weird coincidence that it died at the same time. I have an old Lucas sport coil I might put in but I need to check it's the correct resistance as I run without a ballast resistor).