Ideal engine swap...

[dmcsweeney]

Assuming that you're referring to the m47 diesel variant they were also available in the rover 75 and freelander, though in transverse format.

That's the one. My only slight concern with using this lump would be the famous inlet manifold flaps and turbo seal issues. Out of interest, did this also effect the 75? I take it there are modified inlet manifolds available now?
Regards,
Dave

 

[Tom W]

That sounds like it would make a really great daily driver

 

[sowen]

Assuming that you're referring to the m47 diesel variant they were also available in the rover 75 and freelander, though in transverse format.

That's the one. My only slight concern with using this lump would be the famous inlet manifold flaps and turbo seal issues. Out of interest, did this also effect the 75? I take it there are modified inlet manifolds available now?
Regards,
Dave

I did a lot of research before buying the 75 and never came across any reference to those problems. I think there are now two dedicated 75/zt forums going at the moment, and the one I often scan over I don't think I've seen anything like those come up. You could do a lot worse than that engine anyway, but I can't give it my own stamp of approval until it's hit 300k miles like my previous '98 vectra di and '01 mondeo tddi (over 150k miles and counting on the 75... ).

The main issue with the diesel in the 75 I think is the maf sensor, but that is easily sorted with an aftermarket tuning box and alternative maf sensor to the troublesome bosch unit. Peel away all the plastic and it's just like any other internal combustion engine, just with a few more than actually necessary sensors to play up. The 75 and freelander engines are detuned from the standard bmw output of 150bhp to about 105bhp and 135bhp, and apparently they take remaps happily, although I doubt the rear axle would be happy . I'm sure an ecu could be decoded to work on any engine, but that is going way beyond what I know. If you don't want to pay bmw prices, I'm sure the 6 cylinder 2.5 version was also fitted to the vauxhall omega which was rwd, and I'm guessing would have the same bellhousing pattern, although that would need confirming.

Going by looking at my 75, I would say the m47 diesel is a viable option for an engine swap into the p6. The alternator and starter motor are in almost the right place to wire up into the existing p6 4 cylinder engine bay, and the standard turbo and manifold are tight against the block in a sensible position, although the mounts may need some careful consideration?

 

[dmcsweeney]

.

If you don't want to pay bmw prices, I'm sure the 6 cylinder 2.5 version was also fitted to the vauxhall omega which was rwd, and I'm guessing would have the same bellhousing pattern, although that would need confirming.

Simon,
in a moment of boredom last night i had alook on a salvage auction site and found a 01 320d that had hugged a tree broadside at speed. The passengers side was shaped like a banana but the front end and transmission area had survived, meaning engine, rad, intercooler etc were ok, and it was a runner. Not sure what it made in the end but was going for very small money and the auction was nearly over. I'd feel that the straight six might sit too far forward and upset the balance. Now that you mention ford, you could probably mate the TDDi or the TDCi to a type 9 from a sierra, as they share the same box (MT 75 i think) in the mondeo as the Zetec (for which there is an RWD adapter available). I'd ditch the DMF tho!! :evil: It was one terrible point with these engines as I found out in my 2.0d X-type (now running a heavy duty clutch and solid flywheel from a transit )
Regards,
Dave

 

[sowen]

I would definately have a look at the ford tddi, not the tdci, as it seemed like a 100% bulletproof engine. I never had any trouble with the engine, just the mondeo around it started to fall apart (not bad for a 300k mile repmobile). I believe it was the same as the transit engine and had a solid flywheel, but did sound like a rough tractor, unlike the bmw lump which is as loud as my 2000tc engine. I never had to do any major work top the mondeo which involved raising it so I never had a good look and measure of the lump itself. Is it wrong that I almost always take a tape measure to an engine bay when I see a bonnet up? :roll:

 

[colnerov]

I thought I was the only one that did that. Colin

 

[dmcsweeney]

Is it wrong that I almost always take a tape measure to an engine bay when I see a bonnet up? :roll:

Hhmmm,
I'm starting to think the rest of us are wrong for missing the oppertunity . I'm getting ideas now! I'll be in the worshop tomorrow, must measure the TDCi in my X-type and see would it fit in the V8 engine bay . Would be one way of curing the misfire in my white car!! Don't suppose there's a V8 diesel out there that would fit :? , now if only i'd measured the lump in the TDV8 range rover! Don't worry, i'll stop before this gets out of hand! My experience of the TDCi thus far has been pretty good, except for the previouly mentioned duel mass, and the fact that the EGR valve and inlet manifold need periodic cleaning to prevent black smoke under heavy throttle. It's not the most refined unit in the world, but has decent torque (333Nm @ 1900RPM) and the advantage of chain driven cam. I have taken the precaution of reducing the oil change interval from 12.5k miles down to 6k though. I believe this engine is a development of the TDDi, which in turn was based on the 1.8TD Endura used in the MK1 Mondeo (I still have my old '96 one in a corner of the workshop I like it so much!)
Regards,
Dave

 

[colnerov]

Hi, yes there is a V8 diesel a GMC 6.2/6.5. I have one in the Range Rover, it is not
much bigger than the RV8 but a lot heavier I would not recommend it for a P6. I did
consider it but I am not even sure about putting one in the P5, not the right character
of engine, very agricultural. A more modern, quieter diesel engine would be better.

 

[dmcsweeney]

Hi, yes there is a V8 diesel a GMC 6.2/6.5. I have one in the Range Rover, it is not
much bigger than the RV8 but a lot heavier I would not recommend it for a P6. I did
consider it but I am not even sure about putting one in the P5, not the right character
of engine, very agricultural. A more modern, quieter diesel engine would be better.

The GMC V8 certainly is a big beast! I'd imagine even the new Range Rover TDV8 is a big lump, and expensive!! I think a modern 4-cylinder would be more than up to the job in terms of torque, tough wouldn't sound as good. What about a 5-cylinder though?? Wasn't there a plan to fit a 5-cylinder to the P6 during development? VAG TDi 5-cylinder has a nice exhaust note! Mercedes 270 Cdi or Volvo D5? I've seen a RWD conversion on a VAG 1.9 TDi, can remember what box was used (it was in a westfield in Practical Performance Car) so the 5-cylinder or 2.5 V6 VAG TDi units might be an option, and cheap!
Regards,
Dave

 

[webmaster]

Looking through my pile of old PPC mags, they used a Toyota supra box on the back of the VAG engine, using an adaptor kit from the states.

 

[dmcsweeney]

Looking through my pile of old PPC mags, they used a Toyota supra box on the back of the VAG engine, using an adaptor kit from the states.

Richard,
thats the one, i believe it was aimed at the 1.8T VAG engine, the supra box would probably be up to the diesel torque as well.
Regards,
Dave

 

[Junkman]

I'm sure Spen King would have no problem with upgrading to a more modern engine. Inventiveness is the offspring of necessity and engineering pragmatism, after all... and what is the thing about seatback sweat stains about?

Anyway, I've had enough. Moderators, please ban me from this forum, I've had enough of it and I've not got enough time to waste like this. Thanks for completely putting a young potential P6 owner right off the whole idea. You stuffy middle-aged purists will still be moaning about modified cars as you watch the last P6s rust away and get crushed...

I remember watching Chop Shop and the late Spen King (whom my other half knew) was not impressed when they put a non Rover engine into what was the Jet 1 replica

I'm convinced this has to do with the fact that Spen King knew what he was doing. I'm also convinced, that a bunch of shade tree mechanics can't outsmart him. He was one of the best automotive engineers who ever walked the Planet. I'm quite amazed that he and I share a hobby - bicycles. The most ingenious invention ever devised by mankind. And who came up with the bicycle as we know it? Rover.